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Post by Pp3dr0 Ag4o0 on Jul 8, 2009 4:00:10 GMT -8
that all the amazing things you seefeel whilst time is compressed are from some hormone that is supposed to be secreted at the moment of death, compressing time at that moment for your perceived eternity thereafter, and making claims of eternal joy or fear seem very real, but if you use this hormone up while you live, there'll be none left for when you're dead? if anyone has heard this rumour then do let me know, cos it puts me on the spot quite a bit !
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Post by kirk on Jul 8, 2009 4:12:26 GMT -8
Well not exactly no. What I understand is that research has been done into cases where people have a near death experience. Evidence seems to say that similar type events often happen - that people experience a life review, see a tunnel or meet deceased relatives and are generally in a calm state about all this. It's presumed that some organ within the brain is responsible for producing this effect. But who knows ? Science has yet to prove that your brain or my brain is you or me, some postulate that we are elsewhere and the brain is nothing but a conduit.
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Post by philly on Jul 8, 2009 4:14:14 GMT -8
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Post by kirk on Jul 8, 2009 4:18:23 GMT -8
If you accept the many world premise of Quantum Physics then it would seem that my brain or your brain are not me or you. If we die in this (our) universe we still exist in parallel universes (or die there while still existing in this one). I wouldn't worry !, I can't remember where I was before I was born (or if I WAS), I expect the same at the other end of life. I certainly wouldn't relish the idea of immortality in the company of Margeret Thatcher or Pol Pot or Michael Jackson (for instance).
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Post by kirk on Jul 8, 2009 4:34:59 GMT -8
From the link site:
All life within the envelope of earth's vibrational influence attempts to match base-frequencies (entrainment) with that of the earth.
New age codswallop. There are no base frequencies and entrainment is just a mispelling of Entertainment (which the link is)
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Post by philly on Jul 8, 2009 4:38:52 GMT -8
yeah, i guess i hit the wrong link too quickly, but there is something somewhere about the pineal gland releasing dmt, at birth, death, I read it somewhere........ google dmt and pineal gland.
Have a nap, that'll sort you out.
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Post by Pp3dr0 Ag4o0 on Jul 8, 2009 4:40:23 GMT -8
thankyou philly - i feel much better now ! unless the DMT can be used up of course...
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Post by djfirefly on Jul 8, 2009 6:29:08 GMT -8
From the link site: All life within the envelope of earth's vibrational influence attempts to match base-frequencies (entrainment) with that of the earth. New age codswallop. There are no base frequencies and entrainment is just a mispelling of Entertainment (which the link is) Well, I don't know about base-frequencies and all that, but entrainment is a real phenomenon. For instance, it happens when women work or live together for a period of time - their menstrual cycles will often become aligned. Wikipedia has entries for it under a number of regular "scientific" disciplines: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EntrainmentYeah, it's fun to poke fun at the new-agers because they tend to take perfectly normal phenomena and use flowery words and hyperbole to describe it. Unfortunately, that practice has surely hindered serious researchers from investigating new/unknown phenomena in an un-biased way. Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. Just imagine what someone from the 19th century would think to walk down any city street today and see a bunch of "crazy" people talking wildly into weird little devices that talk back (!) and blink and play strange music at the oddest random times. Oddweird indeed.
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modo
Junior Member
seeking quietness within
Posts: 94
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Post by modo on Jul 8, 2009 7:01:41 GMT -8
so like entrainment of a crowd through a repeating rhythm, then adding shape and flow, decoration and energy growth to message sounds and beyond...?
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Post by kirk on Jul 9, 2009 0:28:21 GMT -8
The problem as I see it is that many people do quote from Wikepedia and it is notoriously unreliable and factually inccorect. Many a student has done just this and has not bothered to read his or her course study books and has failed the course they were studying. The reason that Womens menstrual cycle starts to align when they co habit is due to the hormone eostrogen and is not something paranormal or some unseen Gaian force (Enrainment). This is well documented and scientifically proven and has been known for a long time.
I don't think its fun to poke fun at new agers per se, but new agers in particular tend to believe whatever someone tells them without doing their own research (again not Wikepedia). The most famous "fact" that did the rounds recently was "a butterfly flaps its wings and...." and yet there is no direct source for this phrase, people were quoting quantum physics, Mayan prophesy as the source of this quote yet it appears that no one knows who said this. I'm not sure as to who hinders scientific research. It is more likely to be persons making far fetched claims that are not borne out when studied, although James Randi and his associates tend to rubbish any academic studies on anything they think does not correspond to their Newtonian view of the universe. They and many quantum physcists forget that science has indeed moved on and that the Newtonian view is outdated. This proves how conservative science and scientists are, Quantum physics poses many odd questions and provides staggeringly odd answers. Many in this field ignore these implications and use Niels Bohrs "Copenhagen Interpretation" and never consider what Einstein's "spooky action" actually implies, that there are an infinity of parallel universes and that every particle (or wave) in your body simultaneously exists in these universes. We are all one, All universe is one, the big bang was a Quantum singularity exploding (a singularity forms in the centre of a black hole). Someone or someone had to be around at the time of the big bang to observe what happened because it appears that the act of observance is what causes things to happen. Either that or Einsteins view of time being a fourth dimension is incorrect because it seems that the future already exists and that particles in the present have a direct link with particles in the future and the past.
Anyway rambling on and on..need a coffee and a cig now. I'd like to recomend some nice bedtime reading for anyone interested in Quantum physics and the stuff I 've been rambling about.
Parallel Universes by Fred Alan Wolf (isbn; 0370313739)
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Post by yogbarogger on Jul 9, 2009 3:46:41 GMT -8
Nice discussion Kirk. As to your recommended reading, I either have already read it (in the future) or have read it infinite times in infinite number of manifestations, so may just stick to "What I know about me is what I know about you" which I will write in a while.
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Post by kirk on Jul 9, 2009 5:25:58 GMT -8
I either have already read it (in the future) or have read it infinite times in infinite number of manifestations....
Yes, but you could say that about any experience including hearing Yum Yum Tree Yoggy. But it don't make it less interesting do it ?
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Post by philly on Jul 9, 2009 5:33:01 GMT -8
There is Nothing
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modo
Junior Member
seeking quietness within
Posts: 94
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Post by modo on Jul 9, 2009 9:22:41 GMT -8
as the branches of infinte POSSIBILITY divert and convolve, then at the 'end' of this most peculiar singularity all those branches must reconvene to form a stem again at then other end to then branch out again - or else they must effloresce and drop their fruit - let's hope that there's enough receiving and emitting efflorescences to make some fruit and drop the beginnings of new universes into the soil of everything...
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Post by yogbarogger on Jul 9, 2009 11:57:26 GMT -8
I remember you telling me that Kirk in the year 3Q.4db, and it was interesting at that time, but then again you were a 17ft octoped named Bzk and we were listening to Ed's new solo album
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Post by philly on Jul 9, 2009 21:24:35 GMT -8
that would have been his pre birth album then Matt?
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Post by yogbarogger on Jul 9, 2009 22:07:22 GMT -8
his pre- third birth album "The gravity well is too far away"
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Post by kirk on Jul 10, 2009 3:42:06 GMT -8
Oh yes I remember you as an octoped Yoggy, you sprayed me with thrunge and I immediately recognised you as a member of a thdila throgue. I seem to recall you were with calf at the time, and our mating was most Gazada !
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Post by yogbarogger on Jul 10, 2009 3:49:01 GMT -8
The less spoken about the mating the better - but as it is repeated infinite times, I guess its bound to come up in coversation
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Post by kirk on Jul 10, 2009 4:05:20 GMT -8
It certainly came up when you sprayed thrunge over me. My agitator was most manifold.
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Post by kirk on Jul 10, 2009 4:17:47 GMT -8
cop this.
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Post by quinoa on Jul 10, 2009 10:21:01 GMT -8
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Post by garlicmick on Jul 11, 2009 12:08:08 GMT -8
that all the amazing things you seefeel whilst time is compressed are from some hormone that is supposed to be secreted at the moment of death, compressing time at that moment for your perceived eternity thereafter, and making claims of eternal joy or fear seem very real, but if you use this hormone up while you live, there'll be none left for when you're dead? if anyone has heard this rumour then do let me know, cos it puts me on the spot quite a bit ! Hard to imagine how it could have evolved if specifically to do with death. It would have nil survival/reproductive value. Maybe it's an example of some more general stress response?
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Post by garlicmick on Jul 11, 2009 12:11:06 GMT -8
The most famous "fact" that did the rounds recently was "a butterfly flaps its wings and...." and yet there is no direct source for this phrase, people were quoting quantum physics, Mayan prophesy as the source of this quote yet it appears that no one knows who said this. wasn't it from James Gleick's Chaos ??
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Post by kirk on Jul 13, 2009 0:04:50 GMT -8
Garlickmick said : Hard to imagine how it could have evolved if specifically to do with death. It would have nil survival/reproductive value.
Does that not presume that all functions of the body and mind are strictly focused upon evolution and procreation as per Darwinism ? Thats not my reality labyrinth, but if you want that one go for it.
I don't know if the quote re Butterflys was from James Gleicks "Chaos", or if what James said was accurately reported if he did say it, as I haven't read the book. There is no such Scientific theory as Chaos Theory, just lots of semi academic books talking about it, in much the same way that people talk about the Pyramids or Stonehenge or Dousing. No one knows, and if they do I'd like to see the equation that proves that a butterfly could in reality cause a storm etc. Chaos theory is often quoted to show that this that or the other is possible, Any time someone has a pet theory out trots Chaos theory "Well it could happen!, Chaos theory says so". This without the slightest bit of Science in there.
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Post by orpheus on Jul 13, 2009 0:28:20 GMT -8
I would say personally that I don't believe all functions strictly adhere to the supposition of evolution, although I am most certainly not scientifically minded so could offer very little argument. But for instance, the arts. What possible function would they serve towards bettering our chances of survival....or at least what evidence is there that they are part of nature's design. One could argue that playing music may attract a mate or a painting may be an outlet for emotions that cleanses one's psychology. But I don't think either case is true. We create works of music, art and literature for reasons entirely beyond that. Maybe we do these things because we are evolutionarily 'safe' at this moment in time and we therefore have the luxury of expression. It's interesting to note other animal's behaviour and to wonder how much of that is purely mating ritual and if any of it could be considered other forms of expression.
In any case, from my own point of view I'm tempted to say that art is an abstract expression of the sense of wonder and mystery that surrounds us. An attempt to be part of something totally intangible. But then again there are many artists who are completely atheistic and would argue that to say so is complete hyperbole so who knows
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Post by kirk on Jul 13, 2009 7:31:41 GMT -8
HMMM, lots to think about there Kev. Animal Psychologists used to believe that no other animal other than man mated for fun or was creative for the sake of being creative, but then people studied dolphins and Chimpanzees and they found oodles of stuff not related to Mating and evolution.
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Post by orpheus on Jul 13, 2009 9:09:11 GMT -8
Well it has been shown that some animals engage in same sex activity and I'm pretty sure as animals rely on pheromonal cues they are probably aware they are not engaging in sex to reproduce in those circumstances...unless of course it is a genuine case of mixed chemical signals. but just because we don't see silverbacks stringing up stratocasters doesn't mean they're not engaging in some sort of expressive activity. I watched a David Attenborough clip recently where he suggested that chimps swinging over a fast flowing river were doing so as a reverential act.....to revel in the feel and sound of such natural forces.
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Post by kirk on Jul 13, 2009 23:48:08 GMT -8
Hey Kev :just because we don't see silverbacks stringing up stratocasters doesn't mean they're not engaging in some sort of expressive activity.
They string up Les Pauls and call themselves Oasis. Sorry Oasis fans ! (Not really).
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Post by philly on Jul 14, 2009 0:29:59 GMT -8
Epiphones at that.... and ES335.
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